We are experiencing a dark period lately because a lot of programs are falling and being moved to the "On Hold" or "Closed" sections of the MMG forum.
Why is this happening?
What are the programs you are a member of that are falling?
Who to blame?
The Admin? If so, why?
The Members? If so, why?
Could that be prevented? If so, How?
Which lesson are we learning from this dark period?
Would you continue to join Online Programs anyway?
If so, what are you REALLY expecting from an online program?
If I forgot an important question or aspect of this subject, please, feel free to make suggestions.
Thank you,
Monee ....
cashmailers.com
Aug 1 2005, 11:58 PM
maybe it is better to tell me what program does work
jayzee
Aug 2 2005, 12:51 AM
yes..i notice quite a number is falling or declare closed.... i think the forex market is not doing well for them?
alexeow
Aug 2 2005, 12:59 AM
I'm one of the lucky guy not in all the falling programs recently except PS. But I still lucky because I only have a low $40 in PS and they announced to refund after closed down.
kamaruchan69
Aug 2 2005, 01:36 AM
yes suddenly most sites are closing down . im a newbie and havent made profit at all . PS,nuts-4-gold,bullinvestment,
kamaruchan69
Aug 2 2005, 01:40 AM
so the corporate ladder won after all? i shud study harder n score better marks now
ASFx
Aug 2 2005, 02:00 AM
I don't see anything abnormal here. Programs come and go. No programs last forever. Even the big ones will die someday. Just make sure you plan ahead and you will be fine.
stormy
Aug 2 2005, 03:01 AM
that's right ASFx.... programs come and go...no body here going to leave online investment world. we are here for long time and know how new programs come to change everything.
we had mlm's then rendomizers, 3x3 matrix's, bubblers, cyclers, doublers,hyips, and now most popular autosurfers so it's a circle of new programs. programs will never stop to come with new idea's and people here will not stop investing.
Global*Money
Aug 2 2005, 03:08 AM
Thats right, program come and go.. most importantly you must know WHEN and WHERE to put your money! Never trust advertisment too much. Plan ahead of what to do.. failing to plan is planning to fail. and never invest money you cannot afford to lose.
Monee
Aug 2 2005, 03:40 AM
QUOTE(cashmailers.com @ Aug 2 2005, 12:58 AM)
maybe it is better to tell me what program does work [right][snapback]351955[/snapback][/right]
Good reason to try to understand why these programs are not working and yet, we keep on joining them!
Monee
Aug 2 2005, 03:46 AM
QUOTE(ASFx @ Aug 2 2005, 03:00 AM)
I don't see anything abnormal here. Programs come and go. No programs last forever. Even the big ones will die someday. Just make sure you plan ahead and you will be fine. [right][snapback]352117[/snapback][/right]
Agree, that's life. Maybe we should keep this in mind and not be so disappointed when a program closes door. Planning ahead as you said, and we should be fine.
Monee .....
FinallyRetire
Aug 2 2005, 04:06 AM
QUOTE(Monee @ Aug 2 2005, 07:46 AM)
Agree, that's life. Maybe we should keep this in mind and not be so disappointed when a program closes door. Planning ahead as you said, and we should be fine.
I threw out the chill pills with 3 programs I was in going down this past week. I just don't rant anymore, just take your loss and move on to the next. That is the way it has always been and always will be. You can scream until you are blue in the face but it won't change anything but distract you from making more money in the future.
Any loss hurts but it's part of this wonderful game we all play
future
Aug 2 2005, 04:20 AM
QUOTE(Global*Money @ Aug 2 2005, 01:08 PM)
Thats right, program come and go.. most importantly you must know WHEN and WHERE to put your money! Never trust advertisment too much. Plan ahead of what to do.. failing to plan is planning to fail. and never invest money you cannot afford to lose. [right][snapback]352177[/snapback][/right]
Well said, this guys knows what he is talking about
TheMobileHookup
Aug 2 2005, 04:22 AM
QUOTE
I threw out the chill pills with 3 programs I was in going down this past week. I just don't rant anymore, just take your loss and move on to the next. That is the way it has always been and always will be. You can scream until you are blue in the face but it won't change anything but distract you from making more money in the future.
Any loss hurts but it's part of this wonderful game we all play
Have to agree with Mike.
You take the losses and move on.
I lost a few times but I barely join any programs so my losses are minimal.
Since the year started I joined TGT and WWA. That's it.
Sometimes you have to be way more selective.
I never trusted autosurfs but when PIN said "Hey we have one"...of course I went right into it. PIN has help hedge my losses so when I lose it's not a big hit. Never trusted HYIPs...I don't trust many thins out there so I may be the wrong person to answer this but my strategy sure works.
Renee
Aug 2 2005, 04:32 AM
I think Mobile's right. Being very selective is the way to go. I'm learning that autosurfs that offer even 2% are likely to have problems, so I'll be giving any autosurf that offers 2% special scrutiny and definitely pass on all the other higher percentage ones. I like TGT anyway, and may stay with that, and I'll join WWA as soon as I can. So far it seems stable and well planned.
Selectivity is the word of the day, I guess. I think it's important to be honest with ourselves and each other about the survival chances of many of the new programs posted in this forum. I rely a lot on the wisdom of the admin and mods when they talk about programs.
Monee
Aug 2 2005, 04:49 AM
QUOTE(Global*Money @ Aug 2 2005, 04:08 AM)
Thats right, program come and go.. most importantly you must know WHEN and WHERE to put your money! Never trust advertisment too much. Plan ahead of what to do.. failing to plan is planning to fail. and never invest money you cannot afford to lose. [right][snapback]352177[/snapback][/right]
Great advices here! Thanks G*M for your input.
Marlena
Aug 2 2005, 05:06 AM
Well, it's not quite silly season yet, but after stuff like IT and RM crashing, you can always expect a bunch of smaller scams to crop up en masse. Just how the place seems to work. People are a bit desperate, and scammy admins play to greed and fear.
TheMobileHookup
Aug 2 2005, 05:15 AM
QUOTE(Marlena @ Aug 2 2005, 09:06 AM)
Well, it's not quite silly season yet, but after stuff like IT and RM crashing, you can always expect a bunch of smaller scams to crop up en masse. Just how the place seems to work. People are a bit desperate, and scammy admins play to greed and fear. [right][snapback]352315[/snapback][/right]
I wouldn't say that... Well not with those type of programs. That's what the doublers were for. The ones where you buy shares and so on.
Those type of programs are harder to emulate.
It really depends on the person because you don't want to condemn someone trying to do the same thing and then they fail just because of "I've seen this before"
Hell, there were people who tried to help save the "doiubler" and it just didn't work
So doublers died. Something has to come in and take it's place.
It's evolution...
Marlena
Aug 2 2005, 05:22 AM
It's still a pattern and I know you've seen it before too. Big proggie crashes, bunch of little scams pop up, and then another big proggie comes along.
You just seem to notice the little scams coming out of the woodwork more after something big goes down. Some of them aren't intentional scams, granted, but if you look at some of the more truly bizarre HYIP threads that have cropped up the past few weeks (Mystery2Misery, SharetheCoke, SunflowerSeeds, POT)...uhh...I rest my case.
nuk
Aug 2 2005, 05:24 AM
QUOTE(jayzee @ Aug 2 2005, 01:51 AM)
yes..i notice quite a number is falling or declare closed.... i think the forex market is not doing well for them? [right][snapback]352032[/snapback][/right]
I don't think there is a single one that is doing anything in forex and that's probably a GOOD thing. NUK
TheMobileHookup
Aug 2 2005, 05:26 AM
QUOTE(Marlena @ Aug 2 2005, 09:22 AM)
It's still a pattern and I know you've seen it before too. Big proggie crashes, bunch of little scams pop up, and then another big proggie comes along.
You just seem to notice the little scams coming out of the woodwork more after something big goes down. Some of them aren't intentional scams, granted, but if you look at some of the more truly bizarre HYIP threads that have cropped up the past few weeks (Mystery2Misery, SharetheCoke, SunflowerSeeds, POT)...uhh...I rest my case. [right][snapback]352346[/snapback][/right]
Those were bad from the start... I never even considered reading the threads because how it was presented.
Selectivity is the key word of the day
Mystery2Morphine...You had to make a "trust" spend to get your money. Big tip off right there.
SharetheWealth. Karen seemed to be okay at first but it got bizarre. But it's a randomizer...without a lot of people it's crap. Needs a prelaunch and all that.
Sunflower? Sorry I couldn't invest anywhere where the admin is a guy with the name "Sunflower"...
POT...didn't look good in my eyes at all.
It's all evolution to the next good one or big one.
WWA came from the ashes. TGT came when some of the surfs were starting to falter...so good does come from bad but have to be selective. Bad comes from good also like you said but some are obvious and people still jump in.
I called 4Daily like 2 months before it went belly up...watching failure and such you can predict things with the signs.
Marlena
Aug 2 2005, 05:28 AM
I didn't put money in em either, Eddie, but you can't tell me those people had honest intentions.
Or maybe there's some kind of contagious mass insanity going around.
TheMobileHookup
Aug 2 2005, 05:34 AM
Well miss Marlena...Karen seemed to but it wasn't well planned...the others...crapshoot.
But Mystery2Misery? It looked bad from the start.
Marlena
Aug 2 2005, 05:37 AM
QUOTE(TheMobileHookup @ Aug 2 2005, 05:34 AM)
Well miss Marlena...Karen seemed to but it wasn't well planned...the others...crapshoot.
But Mystery2Misery? It looked bad from the start. [right][snapback]352359[/snapback][/right]
Yah. That guy didn't spend a fortune on web design. Hell, he didn't spend an afternoon on it.
The rest of em looked pretty..shaky..at best as well, though prolly his web page takes the cake.
nuk
Aug 2 2005, 05:44 AM
QUOTE(Monee @ Aug 2 2005, 12:54 AM)
[i]We are experiencing a dark period lately because a lot of programs are falling and being moved to the "On Hold" or "Closed" sections of the MMG forum.
Why is this happening?
What are the programs you are a member of that are falling?
4D=real good return but I got in at the start, some stuck money PIPS=same as above, serious stuck money though IT=fantastic return, just some SDs left EZWBD=smaller profit. It's in the On Hold section so I mentioned it. Also dead ones Prime, JohnsonHYIP, Super-Profit and StinkInvest. Made money in all and left some behind too. About 4K in Prime,
Sunflower=loss Sonic=loss Departure Central=chargedback on them when they wouldn't refund me.
QUOTE
Who to blame?
The Admin? If so, why?
Somewhat. These are PONZIS so they all rely on new spends to stay alive. The admin has to know that the money will slow down and be prepared to do something besides stall. My suggestion is to CLOSE DOWN. When it's over, it's over.
4D and IT both had admins kill their opwn progs by doing nothing in the good times. They acted like the good times would last forever and when they slowed, they had no plan at all except to stall and bull****.
The other problem is most Admins are bottom-feeders looking to make a quick-buck and prey on the unsuspecting and ignorant. The admins also tend to be rather dumb.
QUOTE
The Members? If so, why?
I have never seen a good program killed by the members or a discussion forum. If the program sucks, it's going to die no matter how enthused and hard-working the members are. What ere the members suppose to do? Spend more money? Recruit people into a program they know has payout problems and is dying?
QUOTE
Could that be prevented? If so, How?
Only temporarily. They all will die sooner or later. It's just a matter of making a prog last till the *later* By design, it's impossible for 98% of the progs to last for years.
QUOTE
Which lesson are we learning from this dark period?
I really really hope that some are learning several things: a) don't invest more than you can afford to lose. Really. Don't dream. b) these are ponzis and may not be legal everywhere. There's a reason for that. Treat these as games, not businesses. c) Stop believing the lies. Absent of proof otherwise, assume the admin is lying or simply over-hyping his/her prog. d) there are no *secrets* that some schmuck admin dreamed-up that is going to make everyone rich. No secret system, no stupid MISSION STATEMENT, no *we can do achieve it all if we stick together* nonsense.
QUOTE
Would you continue to join Online Programs anyway?
Yes, but even more cautiously than I do now. The last 3 months I've been real conservative.
QUOTE
If so, what are you REALLY expecting from an online program?
To get paid long enough to make a good profit before it dies. The less total I have to hear from an admin, the better. Just run it and save your bit about changing the world for those who are naive.
NUK
Gizmo
Aug 2 2005, 05:59 AM
Well so far I think Mobile has the best advice and that is be selctive. There are a lot of good programs out there if we take the time to check them out. Sometimes we seem to forget that programs that pay high percentages will collapse, because even though we all know they can't sustain payout, a quick return is always tempting. If we do our DD and keep the bulk of our income generation in good solid programs, then we can play around with the tempting HYIP's and not worry if a program goes under. Granted even a good program may fold eventually for one reason or another, but at least we will be able to have a longer time to generate income from them. I also think that a good program will have an admin that is willing to communicate with its members, and not keep them in the dark like some programs have done. Just my 2 cents.
lv2makemoney
Aug 2 2005, 06:09 AM
Great posts here.
I used to believe in doing a lot of diversifying, not anymore. Now I just stick with only a few. And if it is Over-hyped I won't even touch it. Like NUK said, if they start talking about saving the world, that is a red flag to me and I won't invest at all. I still think it is good to diversify a little bit, but not throwing money into everything that comes along. Sure, you have to gamble and risk a bit to earn some real money, but just make sure you've done your DD first and the risk will be minimized. It's really important to remember that "long term" online is really "short lived" in the real world!
Monee
Aug 2 2005, 06:23 AM
QUOTE(nuk @ Aug 2 2005, 06:44 AM)
4D=real good return but I got in at the start, some stuck money PIPS=same as above, serious stuck money though IT=fantastic return, just some SDs left EZWBD=smaller profit. It's in the On Hold section so I mentioned it. Also dead ones Prime, JohnsonHYIP, Super-Profit and StinkInvest. Made money in all and left some behind too. About 4K in Prime,
Sunflower=loss Sonic=loss Departure Central=chargedback on them when they wouldn't refund me. Somewhat. These are PONZIS so they all rely on new spends to stay alive. The admin has to know that the money will slow down and be prepared to do something besides stall. My suggestion is to CLOSE DOWN. When it's over, it's over.
4D and IT both had admins kill their opwn progs by doing nothing in the good times. They acted like the good times would last forever and when they slowed, they had no plan at all except to stall and bull****.
The other problem is most Admins are bottom-feeders looking to make a quick-buck and prey on the unsuspecting and ignorant. The admins also tend to be rather dumb.
I have never seen a good program killed by the members or a discussion forum. If the program sucks, it's going to die no matter how enthused and hard-working the members are. What ere the members suppose to do? Spend more money? Recruit people into a program they know has payout problems and is dying? Only temporarily. They all will die sooner or later. It's just a matter of making a prog last till the *later* By design, it's impossible for 98% of the progs to last for years.
I really really hope that some are learning several things:
a) don't invest more than you can afford to lose. Really. Don't dream.
b) these are ponzis and may not be legal everywhere. There's a reason for that. Treat these as games, not businesses.
c) Stop believing the lies. Absent of proof otherwise, assume the admin is lying or simply over-hyping his/her prog.
d) there are no *secrets* that some schmuck admin dreamed-up that is going to make everyone rich. No secret system, no stupid MISSION STATEMENT, no *we can do achieve it all if we stick together* nonsense. Yes, but even more cautiously than I do now. The last 3 months I've been real conservative.
To get paid long enough to make a good profit before it dies. The less total I have to hear from an admin, the better. Just run it and save your bit about changing the world for those who are naive.
NUK [right][snapback]352384[/snapback][/right]
WOW!
Thanks NUKy for breaking things down so well .... This answers to most of my questions.
Thanks everyone for your input / contribution to this topic ... Keep bringing in your comments / suggestions.
Monee .....
alexeow
Aug 2 2005, 06:28 AM
QUOTE(TheMobileHookup @ Aug 2 2005, 09:26 PM)
Those were bad from the start... I never even considered reading the threads because how it was presented.
Selectivity is the key word of the day
Mystery2Morphine...You had to make a "trust" spend to get your money. Big tip off right there.
SharetheWealth. Karen seemed to be okay at first but it got bizarre. But it's a randomizer...without a lot of people it's crap. Needs a prelaunch and all that.
Sunflower? Sorry I couldn't invest anywhere where the admin is a guy with the name "Sunflower"...
POT...didn't look good in my eyes at all.
It's all evolution to the next good one or big one.
WWA came from the ashes. TGT came when some of the surfs were starting to falter...so good does come from bad but have to be selective. Bad comes from good also like you said but some are obvious and people still jump in.
I called 4Daily like 2 months before it went belly up...watching failure and such you can predict things with the signs. [right][snapback]352351[/snapback][/right]
I think I have follow your selective style recently.
Just noticed that we have same programs listed in our signature.
flower
Aug 2 2005, 06:46 AM
I take a few picks and place them in high, medium and lowriskcat. Then I just hit hard, take my profit and might play along a little while longer with profit.Of course I loose sometimes like everybody else, but overall it actually looks good Donīt fall in love with a program,just USE it to make you some MONEY and be out of there ,before all breaks loose.LOL..... Or YOU will end up being used Cat and mousegame?Hell Yeah
TheMobileHookup
Aug 2 2005, 11:58 AM
Someone reminded me I joined Plexpay...oops.
So 3 this year.
Well 4...IT was this year not last.
Marlena
Aug 2 2005, 12:03 PM
EZWBD, too, I think.
Or is that name never to be mentioned again?
FinallyRetire
Aug 2 2005, 12:04 PM
QUOTE(TheMobileHookup @ Aug 2 2005, 03:58 PM)
Someone reminded me I joined Plexpay...oops.
So 3 this year.
Well 4...IT was this year not last. [right][snapback]353146[/snapback][/right]
There is more I'm sure
TheMobileHookup
Aug 2 2005, 12:32 PM
QUOTE(Marlena @ Aug 2 2005, 04:03 PM)
EZWBD, too, I think.
Or is that name never to be mentioned again? [right][snapback]353151[/snapback][/right]
Someone benefactored me into that one so I don't count that as willingly joined on my own.
No Mike, there isn't anything else. Told you I'm getting selective in my old age
I didn't join too many before that either...but I was on those yahoo ones when they first started. Made a lot over the first week of those then I swore off them. Because then more came and more people went to others and it just died off...
Evolution.
FinallyRetire
Aug 2 2005, 12:35 PM
QUOTE(TheMobileHookup @ Aug 2 2005, 04:32 PM)
No Mike, there isn't anything else. Told you I'm getting selective in my old age
[right][snapback]353196[/snapback][/right]
You need to have more FUN in your old age
s&S
Aug 2 2005, 12:36 PM
Since I"m a gambler by nature !
I go BIG in a program that I see that have good chance of surviving more that a few months like TGT, WWA, RC etc
So far this strategy works well for me...
cheers,
christyn1224
Aug 2 2005, 12:37 PM
QUOTE(FinallyRetire @ Aug 2 2005, 04:35 PM)
You need to have more FUN in your old age [right][snapback]353203[/snapback][/right]
Agreed! What is life without a little FUN?
Radmax
Aug 2 2005, 12:41 PM
nulife
Aug 2 2005, 03:21 PM
QUOTE(TheMobileHookup @ Aug 2 2005, 11:58 AM)
Someone reminded me I joined Plexpay...oops.
So 3 this year.
Well 4...IT was this year not last. [right][snapback]353146[/snapback][/right]
I'm ready to join Plexpay and it sounds from the forums that it is paying, just having some down time to upgrade security on the web site. Is there a problem with Plexpay? Why fo you say .... oops?
christyn1224
Aug 3 2005, 05:20 AM
QUOTE(nulife @ Aug 2 2005, 07:21 PM)
I'm ready to join Plexpay and it sounds from the forums that it is paying, just having some down time to upgrade security on the web site. Is there a problem with Plexpay? Why fo you say .... oops? [right][snapback]353414[/snapback][/right]
He wasn't saying there was anything wrong with Plexpay, he was saying "oops" because he forgot that he had joined it.
Monee
Aug 4 2005, 10:52 AM
TIME FOR A LITTLE RECAP HERE!
A very popular Autosurf program with a great and honest Admin is closing doors!
- How do you feel about it?
- Is 2% daily (60% a month) too high for a program to last?
- Do you think Studio Traffic will make it to the end of this year? Okay, I know, noone has a cristal ball, but still, what is your previsions on ST?
- Would you continue to include Autosurf programs in your Diversification and Portfolio?
- Would consider joining ManualSurf programs?
- If NO, why?
- If SO, why?
Thank you for your time in addressing these questions.
Monee .....
TheMobileHookup
Aug 4 2005, 10:58 AM
No it's not too high.
People ignore the good ones and spend money in $10 scams all day.
That's why some of the good ones end up going down.
They stopped it before it could happen which is a good thing.
Gizmo
Aug 4 2005, 11:07 AM
Personally I don't think 2% is to high. This is still a sustainable level. I think ST will make it to the end of the year, and there is nothing wrong with a good auto surf program. I believe this is a market correction for the autosurf world, just like in the stock market. Some of the good programs will falter for the reasons Mobile stated. Eveyone sticks a few bucks here and there instead of sticking with a solid program. I would still join autosurf programs, as long as they pay a reasonable percentage, and none of the 20% or 40% daily stuff. Nothing wrong with a manual surfing program either.
Monee
Aug 4 2005, 12:18 PM
QUOTE(TheMobileHookup @ Aug 4 2005, 11:58 AM)
No it's not too high.
People ignore the good ones and spend money in $10 scams all day.
That's why some of the good ones end up going down.
They stopped it before it could happen which is a good thing. [right][snapback]357538[/snapback][/right]
Thanks Mobile for your answer. I agree, the "Scam" mentality is killing good programs. Any strategy to warn people not to join those $10 scams?
TheMobileHookup
Aug 4 2005, 12:26 PM
QUOTE(Monee @ Aug 4 2005, 04:18 PM)
Thanks Mobile for your answer. I agree, the "Scam" mentality is killing good programs. Any strategy to warn people not to join those $10 scams? [right][snapback]357666[/snapback][/right]
Yeah...JUST DON'T DO IT!
Can't tell people what or how to do it. Ultimately it is their choice.
They ignored TGT which was one of the best and had the best support so how can you predict what people will do.
They ignored several other big programs.
This is why I barely join anything.
Great way to cut losses....
Cassiel
Aug 4 2005, 12:53 PM
so what are the good ones now? cos after TGT falling down, i have no f****** idea what's good and what's not
dickensyuen
Aug 5 2005, 12:32 AM
QUOTE(Cassiel @ Aug 5 2005, 04:53 AM)
so what are the good ones now? cos after TGT falling down, i have no f****** idea what's good and what's not [right][snapback]357775[/snapback][/right]
only ST left , but it's running over 2 yrs, so find some other good programs by luck.
PonziHYIP
Aug 5 2005, 12:40 AM
Thats the problem with Ponzis. There comes a time when the pot is empty and therefore close.
webbizgold
Aug 5 2005, 12:54 AM
Gotta find new ponzi pots that are honest and who will pay while they last...lol
PonziHYIP
Aug 5 2005, 12:58 AM
QUOTE(webbizgold @ Aug 5 2005, 02:54 AM)
Gotta find new ponzi pots that are honest and who will pay while they last...lol [right][snapback]358848[/snapback][/right]
Well I can give you one. Its run as an experiment and will only stop paying when the pool of money has gone.
Let me know if you want more details.
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